Secondary Liver Cancer - Eventual Liver Failure and What to Expect

FormerMember
FormerMember
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Hi, my 63 year old father passed away this week as a result of secondary liver cancer, the primary was bowel cancer (which had also spread to his lungs, though the oncologists regarded the tumours on his lungs with far less concern than those on his liver). He was diagnosed with bowel cancer in 2007, after having almost no symptoms until the 11th hour (he was severely constipated for over a week all of a sudden, which led to severe vomiting, casualty, a hospital stay of two nights and 28cm bowel obstruction successfully removed and the results of the tumour take out were malignant - this was back in Autumn 2007).

 

Despite having two rounds of chemo over the two years, the first didn't work too well, the second did work in shrinking tumours but my father was taken of it on cycle 8 out of 12 as side effects of the drug threatened to kill him with a life threatening stroke or heart attack - he developed a blood clot on his lung. Signs of this clot were him not being able to lie down on his side one night, and a bit of pain there - though he never described that as agonising so be aware. The oncologist said that was an unusual reaction to the chemo drug.

 

He then was offered a little hope toward the end of this summer with the potential to go on a drug trial, with a renowned professor, though he was never accepted on this as it was deemed to dangerous in light of blood test results relating to liver function.

My father spent virtually all of his 2 years with cancer taking the dog on long walks, flying long haul to visit me in New York twice, getting on public transport, walking lots over there, going to the pub to meet his friends for a pint once a week, going on holidays to Scotland doing lots of walking with my mam, socialising with friends and family and retaining his friendly, cheerful, gentleman like demeanour. No tears EVER, no bad moods, no depressing talks or even mention of prognosis, perhaps a little more prone to tiredness than usual.

 

Fast forward to a month ago, when I came to visit him from NY - he was suddenly out of the blue a lot more tired and exhausted. He'd been taking steroids about 2 weeks prior to my visit and recently come off then. He was also on the blood thinner warfarin which needs careful monitoring. During my stay he was admitted to hospital, with suspect internal bleeding - they though the pain in his side was a result of misbalance of warfarin and perhaps the extreme tiredness as a result of suddenly being taken off steroids. He was immediately put back on steroids, and the warfarin adjusted - but no avail, as he continued to visit the his weekly warfarin clinic they just couldn't seem to get the balance of his dose right and his INR (which measures the clotting ability of his blood) was off the acceptable scale most of the time.

 

A misbalance of drugs masked the fact that liver failure was taking its effect. The whites of his eyes became slightly jaundiced about 3 weeks ago but just his eyes. As a week progressed his face was a shade of jaundice. He remained his normal self but VERY tired, and took tramadol the pain killer only occasionally (say every two days for a 'stitch like pain that wouldn't go away in his side').

 

I returned to New York, but last Saturday after knowing my Dad had been increasingly tired received a call from my mother saying Dad had been admitted to hospital. He'd had a bad nights sleep on the Friday night, was a little disorientated and on Saturday afternoon when the on call GP reached him at our home he failed a basic coordination test which involved aligning his hands together - the doctor said it was best to admit him into hospital for tests.

 

Dad was admitted to an 'acute care ward' as it was a weekend. I've since heard if it had been a weekday, they may have admitted him into a hospice for a night or two for assessment instead. He had a side room, and was the sickest on the ward by far - everyone else was in wards and were able to hold cups by themselves, talk in full sentences and achieve some sound sleep but not my Dad. By Saturday he was writhing on a bed grabbing the cot sides in pain, he was still talking but with one word answers or very short sentences. By Sunday I was on route to the UK on a plane, meanwhile my mother stayed up all night with my father as he was deteriorating so rapidly, he was down to one word answers and had to use a bedpan for the bathroom or a commode - he was bedridden. He was still taking his medication - steroids, pain killer, anti indigestion etc orally - they were all syrups and able to eat very soft food, like soggy wheatabix or ice cream which was one of the few things he seemed to enjoy at this stage.

 

I arrived on Monday morning at 8am, I took a deep breath and walked into his hospital room. He slowly, slowly turned his head to look at me, his eyes were deep yellow and his skin was a definite yellow, his face a little bloated and the dejected, fed up look in his expression was one of the most remarkable things. I'd never seen such suffering in a man right before my eyes in my life. I held it together for him, as I was conscious not to heighten any anxiety I'm sure he must have felt, told him I loved him and my Dad reach out to hug me and said 'good' in reply. He was totally lucid just so exhausted he was unable to express himself or his wishes properly.

 

As the day progressed my mother went home, leaving me with Dad as she had to urgently let the Macmillan delivery guys into our house to deliver a hospital bed, a commode, a table for a patient to eat off. It took until 5pm for the special ambulance to arrive and for his drugs to come from the pharmacy for him to be discharged. He was sent home with drugs suitable to administers via a syringe driver, for when he wouldn't be able swallow. The discharge process was a mess. He had a yellow prescription chart for the drugs for the driver which we had to take home, it had to be signed off by a Doctor - so a district nurse visiting our home could simply fit the syringe driver whenever my father reached the stage of not being able to swallow drugs orally. The nurses at the hospital checked over the form and said it was good to go - but we later discovered it wasn't, there was a second section which hadn't been signed off by a doctor.

 

After eating tiny spoonfuls of yoghurt on Monday evening and having deep sleep on Monday night, when my father 'woke up' (he wouldn't open his eyes and was in a semi coma, though he did scream out when carers handled his severely swollen legs to wash him) Most significantly he was unable to swallow drugs orally, and I had to waste a lot of time with phone calls back and forth to my GP's surgery to get district nurses out to him immediately (I was told to ring the nurses direct myself, the nurses told me for them to arrive as an emergency the GP had to dispatch them..) After time wasted with these calls the nurses arrived to tell me they could only count the drugs and could not administer them until the doctor arrived. Fortunately I made the judgement call to get the on call Doctor out as an emergency in addition to this, as I mentioned to her on the phone his breathing was becoming laboured and that we were NOT achieving the goal of making sure he was comfortable. It was around midday and he'd had NO medication just a droplet or two or oramorph the pain killer. The doctor arrived and completed the incomplete prescription chart. The driver was fitted, with the syringe in my fathers hand. I was told as it was subcutaneous it would take around 30 mins or so to kick in and the drugs given were a sedative (which I was most concerned with as I hated the thought of him panicking about dying and what the next step after death is), morphine for pain and anti sickness drug. The nurses and doctor left about 20 minutes later, and after a few moments my father opened his eyes for the first time that day and just stared as if unable to focus. My mother and I were holding his hands, kissing him, telling him he wasn't alone ever and how much we loved him. He then shut his eyes again and took his last few breaths, very peacefully..and that was the end.

 

This is a long story and still so fresh. His funeral hasn't even happened yet. I've learnt so much from it though and in short, I'd say that a most of the time liver failure will eventually become evident where a liver secondary is concerned.

First of all when jaundice comes, this is a sign of a build of a the waste product bilirubin in the blood, which the liver normally expels into the bowels - giving poo a brownish red colour. Poos become white, whilst eyes first then skin takes on a yellow tinge. Urine will become red looking, as if blood is in it - but the strong colour is the bilirubin. When these symptoms show, this means liver failure is already very WELL advanced. Dad was becoming exhausted complaining "I just want my energy back" - he didn't want to drive his beloved car or even get out of the car for a breath of fresh air when my mam drove to the beach to let the dog out. He couldn't manage a walk around the block, where as he could 2 weeks before he died. Severe tiredness is also a sign.

 

Then comes acute liver failure, at this stage Dad was becoming a little confused but remained totally lucid - the confusion was very subtle in his case - he'd ask the same question twice in a short space of time and went into the wrong bedroom after getting up for the toilet in the night (though my Mam had just swapped his bedroom to another room earlier that evening, so again subtle signs of confusion).

Eventually my Dad simply became too weak to talk, walk, sleep properly, eat or drink. He went from walking talking eating and drinking to being bedridden writhing in pain, unable to talk in a matter of 4 days. I also think he may have hung on longer suppressing his pain and demise waiting for me to arrive from the USA to see him. He was so brave in the face of it all and considerate to the end, looking pleased saying 'good' when I told him my mam and me were going to have a lie down after 2 days of no sleep the night before he died.

 

His legs were very swollen and so painful to touch he cried out when he was moved. He writhed around a lot unable to get comfortable and clung onto much needed cot sides of the hospital bed. The bed delivered to our home didn't have cot sides so we had to line up two arm chairs against it to stop him from falling out and my mam broke down in tears holding his swollen legs. I forgot to mention that only my mam and I were with him at home during discharge, I am in the third trimester of pregnancy and we were left alone with him at home in a state of discomfort until district nurses arrived at 8pm. Fortunately my uncle who's a GP arrived earlier and helped reposition him - you need 2 able bodied people to move and reposition a 12 stone sick man - you don't realise how much they writhe around into uncomfortable and potentially dangerous positions.

 

A consultant told my mam my Dad was dying on Saturday night but why a Macmillan nurse was not with us to over see his discharge I don't know. Our Macmillan nurse was lovely, but she came after my father passed away - about 30 minutes later. The Monday night before my father's death, he was watched by Macmillan carers NOT qualified nurses. They were lovely women - but it was so close to the end someone should have been on hand to inject him with a pain killer if needs be.

There was a big boo boo with his yellow prescription chart for the drugs administered by the syringe driver - no one took ownership over my Dad's case on the acute care ward at the hospital, and though some staff were exceptional - others were a little clueless tending to talking eating drinking patients in a communal ward, before my dying father in a side room alone with his pregnant daughter. He couldn't talk or eat properly, or drink without a baby's cup being held up to him. Some nurses just didn't use common sense or experience to set their priorities straight.

 

So my advice in short to anyone caring for a patient with a liver secondary which is terminal is:

 

Don't focus on prognosis -there are so many good times my Dad and I had while he had cancer, it didn't stop him from being him and enjoying life until right up until the end really ( I mean 3 weeks before his death).

 

Look out for any signs of liver failure - I mentioned them earlier such as the jaundice etc. When this comes you know the end isn't in the distant future - I'm talking weeks. At this stage be brave and get Macmillan and your assigned nurse as heavily involved as possible.

 

Look out for signs of acute liver failure - severe tiredness, the onset of which seems to happen quickly, very subtle signs of slight disorientation or confusion. It may just be being slower in response to questions or sounding unenthusiastic and a lot quieter than usual on the telephone etc. At this stage go through a checklist of equipment in your mind - you will want your loved one to be comfortable at home at the end and you will need things like:

a baby beaker to drink

straws

oral syringe

A large plastic washing up bowel to fill up with hot water to wash patient in bedside.

New Sponges

At least 3 new sheets for a single bed, patient is most comfortable with thin sheets.

2-3 fitted sheets for a single bed.

Clean towels.

Baby Wipes.

Antiseptic Wipes

Dentyl Alcohol free double layer mouthwash (helps with oral thrush common at this stage) - don't bother with this during the very later stages, you don't want the patient to swallow it.

Pineapple//Orange Juice

Ice-Cream

Favourite Foods

Bottled water Still

Little sponges on sticks to dip in water or pineapple juice to freshen and clean the mouth - district nurses

a bed pan - district nurses provide

catheter tubes - district nurses

Incontinence pads - district nurses

Ask Macmillan social worker about ordering a hospital bed WITH COT SIDES (essential), a commode and table to eat off that hangs over the bed, in advance.

Think about close family members that the patient would take comfort in having bedside for this harrowing experience. Deterioration will last not much longer than a week if acute liver failure sets in - although all patients are different, it's a given that liver failure can be as quick as 48 hours in some cases.

As signs of liver failure progress, to pain and restlessness you will need 2 able bodied adults to be present at all times to reposition and help lift the patient.

If a patient is in hospital or a hospice - you will need 2 able bodied adults to help settle the patient into their home on the day of discharge. If you don't have family or friends suitable for this very personal close experience, contact Macmillan and say you would like a nurse plus at least one carer present. Be pushy and adamant about this - your job is to hold the patients hand and reassure them, otherwise you'll be running round frantically making calls, searching for equipment and struggling to move the patient compromising their lovely of comfort and your precious time with them during their final days.

I'd try to source most of the equipment in private in advance so patient doesn't know, but it's important to have your house well stocked as deterioration can happen overnight and take you by surprise. Also think well in advance about rearranging your house. We didn't want to move furniture until last minute for psychological reasons - we thought my Dad would think we were assuming he was ready to die if we put a bed downstairs too soon. However, I wish we'd moved furniture in advance to make space for a bed, even if the bed wasn't there until later on.

 

Finally, before patient is discharged from hospital the most important drugs are the drugs for the syringe driver. As it is a given that eventually patient will not be able to swallow eventually. The syringe driver drugs are in boxes and they come with a YELLOW PRESCRIPTION CHART WHICH YOU SHOULD PRESENT TO A DOCTOR OR HOSPITAL PHARMACIST TO ENSURE IT HAS BEEN PROPERLY SIGNED OFF FOR (otherwise when you're panicking because patient is in pain and unable to swallow at home, district nurses will not be able to give the drug unless it was signed off for - this could leave a patient in pain for 30 mins or more waiting for an emergency on call doctor to arrive to sign a piece of paper). A high level nurse told me our yellow slip was adequately signed off for in the hospital but it wasn't.

 

It is well worth noting that my Dad was lucid until the end

 

This is such a long post but it's a reflection of just how much there is to coordinate near the end and how important it is to be proactive and anticipate it YOURSELF because Doctors nurses, and MacMillan nurses won't do it for you. They will not spell it out or commit to saying how quick it will be, as yes it's different for the individual. You do not want to be left vulnerable, MacMillan nurses can be really helpful but you need to chase this help, it is not readily available and largely depends upon factors such as how efficient your social worker is and if he/she has good foresight and can handle a busy schedule with an air of control. Beware that YOU will be assessing the situation and making important judgement calls yourself. Make it clear if you don't have home help and demand it, don't be proud.

he could hear but couldn't express himself - of this I'm 110% sure - so make sure you remind nurses, family, friends and any carers of this so they do not talk about death, the 'Liverpool Care Pathway' (which is a system of drugs and procedure regarding not resuscitating patients at deaths door etc) or anything undignified such as patient being unable to go to toilet properly in front of the patient. I'm sure anxiety over death and remaining dignified are 2 key factors during this stage. Anxiety over death/being separated from loved ones to me is worse than anticipation of pain.

 

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Thanks Will, I was so sorry hear to hear about your mum. My thoughts are with you.

    You're right everyone's situation is different.

    We're currently at the stage where although mum is independant (lives alone) her pain and symptoms seem to fluctuate day by day.  A referral by the hospital has put a carer in place 3 times a day (who often only has to have a chat with my mum) a district nurse (a differernt one just turns up whenever and doesn't seem to do much) and a MacMillan nurse. We were told the carer would be the eyes (as my sister and I live 1-2 hours away) and aren't up there everyday and all would liaise with the Dr (a family Dr of over 25 years).  It In reality it just doesn't seem to work. In fact today I was up at my mum's and because she had some problems last night and I needed some adviceI rang the Dr.  He aksed me if she was on codiene based tablets I politiely (yes I was polite but firm) told him shouldn't he have the perscription list. It only seems if he's prompted that'll he'll consider coming round to see my mum so doesn't seem to really know the overall picture.  Being miles away it's difficult to know if she's moving into the next stage of deteriroation as no one seems to have any continuity.

    She has primary bowel cancer, secondary in the liver (which has doubled in size since Nov) now spread to the adrenal glands and possibly the lungs.  She does get quite confused and her memory is very bad except people who see her see a well presented articulate women who deosn't appear confused.  Yet as soon as they are gone she may not remember they've been or what was siad. We just don't know what to look out for or what the triggers are to be concerned especially as a recent prognosis was apporx 1-2 months. Can anyone help. ?

    Thanks again Will for your repsonse, take care.....

    Shaz x

     

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Hi again

    glad the info was of some use to you both.

    Shaz,your Mum sounds just like mine,and all the goings on with doctors who dont seem to have enough time.My Mum did also get confused towards the end but she usually managed to hide it and we knew things were bad when she didnt put on her lipstick.

    I was desperately worried about the timeframe and I think when you dont live near like us then you do become more concerned with this.My journey involved either 9 hours on a train or a flight and I had planned to go up to see Mum as many weekends as I could.For me this was important,it meant I had quality time with Mum on my own.I had to juggle a lot to get there but it was worth it.

    Like your Mum,mines was bowel primary mets to liver.Like yours they had more than doubled in 6 months.My last visit which was when my lovely Mum passed away was supposed to be one of many to happen over the next couple of months.

    When I arrived Mum was on a small dose of morphine.The previous night she had been in a great deal of pain ,more than ever before and it was the first time she had taken morphine.She was awake and greeted me with joy but was a bit woozy.The doc was there so I went to have a few words with her and was told timeline was still weeks but with no guarantees and that the next 48 hours would be crucial.She would either get back to normal or go downhill.

    I spent most of the day in and out of her room.She was in a kind of trance when awake but always very comfortable and not wishing to be fussed over.She did pull herself out of the trance to speak but not much and I think I felt something was amiss.

    At about 10pm the GP phoned to see how she was,but said it would not still be morphine affecting her that would have long gone from her system.A nurse was sent to check her and we tried to get Mum to use the commode(she hadnt needed one before that).Her legs were swollen thats something to watch for,and like Jess'sDads were painful to touch.She wouldnt or couldnt go to the loo(I think constipation is also something to watch for),so the nurse rearranged her bedding a bit and made her comfy.She kept saying'dont worry darling,Im alright,dont worry'.My Dad has been caring for her and he and my Mum went to bed.I kissed my Mum goodnight and she thanked me for coming.I told my Dad to get me in the night if necessary.

    My Dad woke me at 4.30,my Mums breathing was rattley as if she should cough.We managed to get her to sip some water but she was not responding much.Her eyes were open as if in a trance.I called the nurse who came straight away.She checked my Mums feet the bottom of them were a bit blue and she told us Mum was dying.She said it would be within 24 hours.The rattley breathing continued and me and Dad held Mums hand.However she was never uncomfortable with it.Her breathing became quieter and quieter until it stopped.It all happened in a couple of hours.Im crying as I write this but had Mum gone on she would have been catheterised and hospitalised which she would have hated so it was better for her that she went quickly.

    I think the docs find it so unpredictable which is why they are vague with time.I had fully expected to be visiting again,but it wasnt to be.

    Its very hard to come to terms with and Im struggling a bit.In the end Mums passing was quite peaceful and Im so grateful for that.I will always miss her.

    I hope my story doesnt make you worry.I think I was very worried about what was going to happen but in the end our coping mechanisms kick in and we manage to get through these ordeals.

    Sorry to have gone on a bit.Good luck to you both.

    Love Will

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    I think from reading your responces and your story,I can tell your mum (and Dad) raised a very lovely caring son I bet they were very proud.

    My auntie is at the ok stage at the moment and we take every day as it comes.

    You are right about the coping mechanism my Dad was my world and as they were older parents having had me in their 40's I always feared losing him. I lost him to prostate cancer in 2001 and would never have thought I would cope during or after his illness. Good old mechanism.  All the best Julie.

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Oh Will, I was crying with you when I read this, so gald you were able to be with your mum at the end.

    Your reply has allowed me (along with other internet reading) to know some signs and in the meantime it's taking each day/ week as it passes at a time.

    I'm going up as much as possible to my mum's and speak a few times each day.  Sometimes it's hard to believe, we all kow we're going to die at some time but when you know someone close to you is dying and you don't know how long you want them to be able to enjoy life with little or no pain.

    Take care, speak again soon. As I've only just joined the site I'm sure I'll be keeping in touch as things progress.

    Love Shaz

     

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    This is a thankyou to all that have posted on here.  The info is going to be so helpful as we're going through the disease with my mum in law and don't really know what to expect.  Shaz, I know what you're saying with taking each day at a time and I hope you're making some beautiful memories with your mum as we're trying to do.

    Take care

    Angie

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Hi All

    Just thought I would see how you all are.I know its so hard and looking back am amazed at how strong I was able to be for Mum so Im sure you are all the same.

    Im a bit of a wreck since Mum went but I read a lot of things about others in the same boat and realise my rollercoaster of emotions are 'normal'.

    Let me know how you are all getting on.Hope things are as good as they can be.

    Will

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Hi Will

    Thanks for your good wishes. I hope you're coping ok, it must be so hard for you but you must take comfort from everything that you did for your mum.

     I'm still at a bit of a loss because it's all happened so quickly. It's only just over a month since mum in law was diagnosed with cancer and 3 weeks since we were told chemo wouldn't help and I just don't know whether what's happening is 'normal', e.g. she's very weak - can only just get up from a chair and walk to bed (but she isn't eating much so I know that will take it's toll), her breathing isn't very good - she's just gone onto steroids to see if that will help, and she seems to be getting hard of hearing - didn't expect that at all!  I know everyone is different but I suppose what I really want someone to tell me is that the steroids will make her strong enough so that she can at least have a bit of quality in her life, enough for her to move around so that she can get into the garden (which she loves) or for dad in law to take her to their caravan but at the minute I just can't see her being able to do this. Any advice?

    Angie

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Hi Angie

    Firstly Im so sorry that you are going through this- its a hard thing to watch a loved one deteriorate.I can only draw from my own eperience but that may be vastly different from your mum in law.

    I think age is important and health prior to onset of illness.My Mum was 81 when diagnosed but at that time she could have passed for late 60s and was as fit as a fiddle.She had major surgery and that took its toll so when she was 83 she still didnt look it but she could never regain her energy.The cancer ,surgery,infections and finally chemo all took it out of my once vibrant Mum.Yet still she fought .

    That has a lot to do with it,how much fight your mum in law has in her.My mum battled to get out of bed, walk along the corridor, use the loo not a comode.My mum was also on steroids for a bit and they did give her a lift initially.Its so very difficult.To be honest I think it depends on how agressive your mum in laws cancer is.My Mum had it on her liver for several months before she got really weak.However she did go downhill in a big way once it took hold.Is she having scans?You can ask how far it has progressed.

    My Mum developed jaundice in the last month and then we knew we didnt have long and also swollen legs.

    I dont think Im much help.I hope your mum in law gets a boost from  the steroids and does manage to get more active.Im sure it can happen.

    I wish you all the best of luck and thanks for your kind thoughts,its just a bloody horrible time in our lives and I think it cant help but affect you deeply.Good luck and I hope everyone else is OK.

    Will

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Hi Will and Angie, sorry haven't haven't kept in touch recently as so shattered at the end of the day. Things with my mum seem to be getting more difficult. I've noticed over the last 2 weeks or so she's more tired a lot of the time, is feeling nauseus some of the time and her loss of appetitie seems to be getting worse. Her back and abdomen pain fluctuates and can be bad in the morning and then subside or today she's had back pain on and off all day.

    My sister and I have had other problems in having all the right care agencies involved now (carers 3 x a day/ District nurse once a week/ Dr and a MacMilan nurse) but no one is talking to anyone else. There are pages of notes in the files at my mum's updated by carer's and people that visit, but none of them connect and the family Dr has been a big let down.  It was only when I spoke to the Dr after he was about to presecribe  a painkiller my mum shouldn't be (I found out by chance and confirmed with the pharmacy who said she musn't take it  - after they spoke to the Dr he cancelled that perscription (it jsut shouldn't have been me to have to pick this - what had happened if she'd been given the tablets- I won't go there..  I then arranged to meet with the Dr and my mum this week to rationalise her tablets and he said he's give her a proper examination. It's only taken weeks to get to this point and he's meant to be the one oversseing her care! He didn't even know what her percription list was till we spoke.

    Anyway we are where we are and he sat and spoke to me and did examine her and has put her on steroids for 10 days (she had taken them before but they had no effect whatesoever several weeks ago). I think her appetitie may be slighlty improving (tho' difficult to know it's only what she says) and another problem is her short term memeory loss and confusion (this has been there for a few months at certain times- the hospital and we thing although rare it may have been triggered by the chemo tablets she took for a short while.

      Today she rang her surgery and managed to cancel a blood test she was due to have wihtout realising what she was doing.  She doesn't know what money she has in the house as she forgets to check and then thinks she needs to get some more out and borrowed off someone visitng today.

    (She doesn't go out much as although mobile I think it's too much effort and she's too tired. Staying in the house/ garden is a lot easier).

    The Dr suggested a prognosis of a couple of months (this was a month ago) and when we spoke Wed he asked if my sister and I had thought about contingency when we'd need to come up to stay.  What he won't indicate is what sort of stage he feels we're at now and that's the hard thing so we can plan aor know whther it'sweeks or months. There is still no one at home (she's on her own) to oversee her medical care and what she needs on a daily basis. Although she wants to stay at home as long as possible it's really difficult to support her when so much changes each day and we don't know what it means when she has a new pain or symptom that may stay or go and she really needs to be percribed accodingly which no one is doing.

    When do you decide about a hospice?

    It seems if she only has a short time left (and someone does need to tell us)a hospice would be able to provide the care and support and provide for better than is happening at the moment. I suppose she seems quite independant but my sister and I thorughout the day (in between our working day) provide the backup and support and knowledge of what's going that no one else is.

    The MacMillan nuse came a few weeks ago and then we heard nothing so we have forced a visit (the Dr prompted her to make contact) for next week. We feel at that meeting with my sister and mum we need to be told what to expect (no one is telling us) and what options there are to help and at what time. I've reaed the MacMillan booklets which are very good (if upsetting) but we need to talk to soemone that knowns about cancer and knows my mum. We know we're getting closer but find it's so hard to cope as soemtimes you're so wrapped up in teh day to day practical things and support to my mum that it deosn't seem real.  I keep strong and then get very emotional at other times. I'm also so exhausted (mentally and physically as my mum is 2 hours away and I can't drive long distances as I have back problems and RSI in my hands) but know we've a lot more to come and just don't want my mum to suffer / be in much pain when the final weeks/ days come.  Take care to you and everyone reading this .  Speak soon.  Shaz x

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember in reply to FormerMember

    Thanks Will, you may think you're not much help but I can't tell you how much I appreciate your replies, it doesn't feel as if we're quite so much on our own.

    Mum was a very fit and active 73yr old right up until last Christmas. Like your mum she could easily pass for 10yrs younger. She was always out with her friends, doing an IT course at college (only had one module left to do in order to get her CLAIT certificate), walked the dog for an hour every day, went swimming regularly and did pretty much everything for my dad in law who hasn't had good health for years. I think this is why it's all such a shock. Mum isn't having any treatment at all so I think it must be pretty aggressive, she's not been offered any scans or anything - is this normal? In some ways it's good that she doesn't have to go to the hospital for anything because the journey always takes it out of her and makes her feel ill. She's not eating enough to build up any strength, she feels sick a lot of the time and they're still trying to find an anti sickness tablet that works for her.

    The Macmillan nurses are going in every week, as is her own doctor but apart from that there's nothing else happening.

    anyway, thanks again for your response and I hope things are becoming easier for you.

    Angie