There's a Vibe ... and there are clinical trials and the wonders of 'backing up and restoring ...'

4 minute read time.

 

I was going to preface this blog post by saying ‘I am a ‘Carer’ and my husband’s prognosis is very bleak indeed …’   However, I have several problems with that.  One is that the term ‘carer’ is not a term which fits me well because it suggests a stage of dependency which my husband has not reached and, as far as he is concerned, will not reach - ever.   And the other problems?  I am not prepared to go into those; suffice it to say I have been keeping an eye on the probable future and it terrifies me beyond thought and comprehension.

So here is the scene:  The Hounds have been enjoying the snow (it has been a good winter for skiers and snow-loving hounds) and they are gently snoring.  The whole household is exhausted – a great deal of time has been spent tracking down, fruitlessly, the missing mobile phone which has certainly found its way to sunnier climes – we suspect Cuba, via Stockholm.  However, we have discovered that we have inadvertently been using the ‘i-tunes’ ‘back-up and restore’ facility and so all is well, and Our Hero’s new phone is, almost, ‘restored’ to health. 

Our Hero is waiting to hear from the ‘new’  oncologist to find out whether there has been any adjustment to the treatment ‘plan’ – which is really no plan at all.   

There has been not a sound from that quarter.  

We suspect that we have been duped – it is all just a way of making us accept the inevitable – that there is no treatment any more on the NHS except …except for the clinical trial. 

Now, I know that there will be some of you out there who desperately want to be on a clinical trial – any clinical trial – particularly if you have got to the end of the road as far as treatment is concerned.  

And wouldn’t we all, in that situation? 

Which gets us to the gist of this – which is a question of medical ethics.   One of the trials which Our Hero may be offered has already been extensively trialled for lung cancer – with variable success.  The huge company who make this drug have,interestingly,  changed the name of the drug.  Our Hero is, according to the medics, dying but, because he did respond so well to chemo, and he is relatively young, he is a very much better subject than someone older and more compromised physically. (Better results, don’t you think?) It would probably be a Phase II trial which only requires – if you are a lucky researcher and can find enough people who have the ‘right’ kind of cancer in your area – about a hundred ‘patients.’   Then the trial will move onto Phase III – which will be a much larger study.

We have both ethical and logistical problems with this.  Any discussion with the oncologist who is doing the research will involve a hundred mile round trip and, therefore, a great deal of our time, and not inconsiderable expense.  It will, we assume, be a ‘double blind’ trial, so Our Hero may well be getting a placebo.  We might, therefore, be both out of pocket and, much, much more importantly, very much out of time.   

When I have mentioned the ethics of all this to one of the many oncologists we have seen, I have been told ‘that someone has to do it, how can we develop drugs, otherwise?'   After all, we are assured, it can only be done with ‘informed consent.’

But the question must arise, how can you get ‘informed consent’ from those who are, undoubtably, one of the most vulnerable groups of human beings you can ever encounter– the terminally ill?  How ‘informed’ and rational is any ‘consent’ going to be?

Forgive me for being cynical, but the question must be asked: who is going to benefit from this most?   Does the word ‘exploitation’ not spring to mind? 

And before any of you get on your high horses and talk about altruism, and how wonderful it might be for others suffering from cancer in the future, just let me remind you about the position of these global drug companies:  they are not doing business for the greater benefit of mankind – they are doing it for money.   If they were altruistic, they would be giving away their drugs for HIV in developing countries; they would be tackling malaria … (and, Wise Old Cynic, if you read this, for TB) and so on. 

We are not talking here of anything which could be revolutionary like dendritic cell therapy which might trigger a targetted immune response against a specific cancer - a wonder vaccine -  we are just talking about another sort of chemo which has already been trialled on another sort of cancer.  And, as most of us know, some chemotherapy drugs which pass through all the clinical trials are not even remotely guaranteed to be effective – something we had not realized until Our Hero was through his third cycle and had ‘responded well.’   At the time, our oncologist’s delight bemused us – we had had no inkling that ‘response’ rates were statistically so low for this cancer.  Our naivety of course; we didn’t know what questions to ask.

And here we are:  still waiting to hear whether the new oncologist will at least ‘discuss’ the horrible radiotherapy and whether they will perhaps ask a liver surgeon to look at the case. 

In the meantime, an appointment has been made with that researcher ...

Ah – those ‘backup and restore’ functions; don’t we all wish ….? 

A blog from Buzzie - not yet really a 'carer', but caring very much ... 

 

Anonymous
  • FormerMember
    FormerMember

    Just to let you know we are 'caring' too.

    Judi xx

  • What a dilemia, and well put, I guess no one thinks they will be on the placebo so given we all know strong positive vibes makes a difference will they do psycological profiles you could have some fun with that if it was not so serious.

    Will be interesting to see how the broader members respond as this is a good issue that needs to be aired.

    Have you got the doll and pins yet for your general onc he sounds like a right *****

    john

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember

    Hi John and Judi

    Thanks for your comments.  

    I too, John, would be interested to know what other members think, because I am not really sure what I think myself!   We would be less dubious if the research was on something ground breaking - preferably, with no debilitating side-effects!

    I am sorry - I had to do a correction on the blog-post - I had assumed that the drugs companies would at least partially fund all the trials of their drugs.  The situation seems a great deal more complex than that -  they may supply the drugs, but the various trials will probably have money from the various cancer charities, research fellowships and so forth.  Patient support is, as I understand it, provided by the NHS.  So, clinical trials of drugs are being conducted on terminally ill patients within the NHS infrastructure - an NHS which, of course, is purchasing drugs at huge expense from these same companies.  

    How the drugs companies must love the NHS.

    Have I got all this right?  Someone let me know - please.  

    As for the placebo effect John - we have been rather depending on that!   We are great believers in positive thinking  ... and the mind can do extraordinary things ...

    Best wishes to all.  

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember

    hi there buzzie

    i can understand how angry you feel toward the drug companies and the nhs

    but

    its the way new drugs/treatment can be used

    without the trials we would have no drugs

    i know that someone a few years ago would have undergone a trial for the treatment that is successfully treating my son now ....... and i thank each and everyone of them for that x

    i worked in medical research for a few years (only admin) but all the patients i came into contact said how much extra care and attention they received by being on a trial! -our doctors and nurses were the best ;)

    also our department would often pay travel expenses and quite often overnight hotel bills - for patients living far away - may be worth asking about this?

    i do hope that if your hero decides to do the trial - that his is he new "wonder drug" the next miracle treatment that will make headline news

    good luck to you both

    xNx

  • FormerMember
    FormerMember

    G was treated in Germany just after a three year trial ended.  The results were already published when he started treatment.  The trial was carried out by giving all patients the same treatment.  The results were compared aganst already well documented survival rates for other treatments.  I can't speak for other countries, but trials can be done without using placebos.  

    Sadly, in the UK not only does NICE insist on testing the efficacy of drugs in blind trials, but on evaluating the cost effectiveness of those drugs before licences are granted, even when the same drugs' effectiveness had been proven and they are already in general use accross Europe.  And then, funding PCTs decide whether or patients can be given newly licenced drugs.

    Is it any wonder that the UK has one of the lowest cancer survival rates in Europe?

    Trialing of  newly developed drugs is one thing but to deny patients the chance of life prolonging drugs that have already been tested and are being routinely used in other countries is a crime against the most vulerable.